from sarah abbotthttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/dhammastudygroup/message/99261
Back to the neglected #98417 on the Anupada Sutta:-)
Apologies for long quotes at the beginning for context, given the time lapse:
>>Sarah: (Formless-Sphere Moral Consciousness - 4)
> (1) Moral Jhaana consciousness dwelling on the "Infinity of Space",
> (2) Moral Jhaana consciousness dwelling on the "Infinity of Consciousness",
> [S: the object is the first aruupa jhaana citta]
> (3) Moral Jhaana consciousness dwelling on "Nothingness",
> (4) Moral Jhaana consciousness wherein "Perception neither is nor is not".
> [S: the object is the third arupa jhaana citta]
> These are the four types of aruupa-jhaana Moral consciousness."
> S: In other words, the objects of these (the highest jhaana cittas)have
> their own specific objects. There is no 'investigation of dhammas' in them
> and they are only 'portals' or 'bases' or proximate conditions for path
> consciousness if they are directly understood as impermanent, conditioned
> dhammas after they've fallen away. This is in just the same way any other
> or ruupa can be the proximate condition or 'portal' for path consciousness
> if it is directly understood as an object of satipa.t.thaana just prior to
> enlightenment. Whether it be lobha, dosa, jhaana citta or visible object -
> any dhamma at any time can be the 'portal' for enlightenment if the
> conditions are in place.
>Howard: As one example, Sarah, in the Anupada Sutta, please compare what
> occurs within the 7th jhana with what occurs within the 8th:
> 16] "And the states in the base of "Nothingness" - the perception of the
> base of "Nothingness" and the unification of mind; the contact, feeling,
> perception, volition and consciousness, the enthusiasm, decision, energy,
> mindfulness, equanimity, and attention - these states were defined by him one
> by one as they occurred; know to him those states arose, known they were
> present, known they disappeared. He understood thus: "So indeed, these states
> not having been, come into to being; having been, they vanish." Regarding
> these states he abided un-attracted, un-repelled, independent, detached,
> free, dissociated, with a mind rid of barriers. He understood: "There is an
> escape beyond this", and with the cultivation of that attainment, he
> confirmed that there is.
S: These are the factors accompanying the 7th jhana which has voidness as its
object. The reviewing consciousness cittas which immediately succeed the jhana
cittas 'review' and know the cittas, their object and the mental states
accompanying them, just as the reviewing consciousness cittas immediately
succeeding the lokuttara cittas (in the processes of enlightenment)experience
those cittas, cetasikas and object (nibbana).
From the Guide in CMA, ch 1
"The base of nothingness (aaki~nca~n~naayatana): the third immaterial attainment
has as its object the present non-existence, voidness, or secluded aspect of the
consciousness pertaining to the base of infinite space. By giving attention to
the absence of that consciousness, the third immaterial absorption arises taking
as its object the concept of non-existence or nothingness
(nattthibhaava-pa~n~natti) in respect the the first immaterial consciousness."
S: There is no other object of this jhana citta itself. The cetasikas (mental
factors) listed in the sutta are factors accompanying the citta.
In the Bodhi/Nanamoli notes to this sutta, it explains under the first jhana:
"The first five states in the list are the jhaana factors proper of the first
jhaana; the following states are additional components each performing their
individual functions within the jhaana. This minute analysis of mental states
into their components anticipates the methodology of the Abhidhamma, and it is
thus no coincidence that the name of Saariputta is so closely linked with the
emergence of the Abhidhamma literature."
S: As Connie has pointed out, each jhana citta is accompanied by many mental
factors, including all those which arise with every kind of sobhana
(beautiful)consciousness. It is the jhana factors (jhaananga)(such as the five
in the case of the first jhana) that distinguish one jhana from the next in
terms of increasing refinement of the absorption as the grosser jhana factors
> Howard: 17] "Again, bhikkhus, by completely surmounting the base of
> Sariputta entered upon and abided in the base of neither perception nor
> 18] "He emerged mindful from that attainment. Having done so, he
> contemplated the states that had passed, ceased and changed, thus: "So
> states, not having been, come into being; having been they vanished.
> Regarding those states, he abided un-attracted, un-repelled, independent,
> detached, free, dissociated, with a mind rid of barriers. He understood:
> an escape beyond this," and with the cultivation of that attainment, he
> confirmed that there is.
> Within the 7th, Sariputta was able to define various features "one by one
> AS THEY OCCURRED [emphasis mine];
S: A note in the Bodhi/Nanamoli translation explains this difference in wording
when it comes to the 8th jhana:
"This indirect introspective method must be used to contemplate the fourth
immaterial attainment because this attainment, being extremely subtle, does not
enter into the direct range of investigation for disciples. Only fully
enlightened Buddhas are able to contemplate it directly."
S: This is interesting as it seems to even include Sariputta. In the case of the
other jhana cittas and factors, they can be known 'as present objects' by the
immediately succeeding cittas (for these disciples), just as seeing or visible
object can be known 'as present objects' by succeeding mind-door cittas in the
development of satipatthana.
Thanks for pointing out the wording, Howard. I'm glad I took my time to check